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Up set turbulence? Ouch

NW-FLYER

New member
Wenatchee, WA.
Aircraft Year
1977
Aircraft Type
112B
Reg Number
N377SB
Serial Number
526
After leaving Seattle today from our in City base Renton WA, I knew it was going to be a rough ride home over the Cascades. Although only 9 Kt winds on take off winds aloft were strong and there was a moderate turbulent air/sig warning I knew it was not going to be fun but not abnormal either. We climbed out toward the Cascades at 3pm choppy crap weather slugging our way up in a climb. The Commander is a beast of a single built like a brick sh$t house and she don't like being pushed around. Today at 5,500 and climbing only 17 miles out it started getting worse and worse I was doing 100 knots on climb to stay under class Bravo and just at the outer boundary of Bravo when all hell broke loose.
All of the sudden we are upside down in less than two seconds. Not a roll but nose down attitude of about 10 to 15 degrees beyond straight down and rolling to the right from torque.

I have never seen anything quite like this in the small 800 hrs I have flying the friendly sky's. I have slugged it out like every one has but it happened so fast
I didn't know what happened till all I saw was ground in the wind screen. I had crap showering the cockpit from the back seat. Wendy hit her lips on the yoke and luckily I had my belt tight as I could get it my head hit the roof but not hard was slowed at belt limit. I had my cell in my shirt pocket and later found it in the baggage compartment after landing you get the idea it was a good hit.

Lucky for us both a good buddy of mine Arnie Clarke a silver star recipient 4 tour Nam fighter pilot had spent hours forcing me to learn UP SET training. Foggles on he would get way out of trim go straight down starting a spin ( this was in a bonanza 35 spins prohibited) and pull off my glasses and say it's you airplane!

I absolutely hated that training it scared the crap out of me. But he would always coax me back up to do it again saying some day you will need this trust me.

That day was today... Going from full power climb to straight down plus 10 or 15 degrees in 1.5 seconds I didn't have to think it was training. I stoped the roll / spin tendicey 1st with the rudder, then power back to the stops, then having a stable horizon to focus on even if it's all ground you pull up slow, slow, slow because you don't know what speed your carring you don't have time to look you will bend that ship like a tin can if you panic he used to tell me. Thank you Arnie I leveled dropped the gear for stability and turned 180 we got a hotel and a stiff drink. I have to hand to Wendy she is one tough girl. We have been trough some scary stuff in our years as aviators and she is rattled for a drink but let's go tomorrow shake it off we can handle it :o)
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

Dear BriAn,

While terrible that you experienced what you did, your good knowledge and skills from the great training you received kicked in and you executed exactly to recover rapidly and favourably. Well done sir. A stiff drink is indeed appropriate, and even three!

Best regards,

Pete
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

Man oh man Brian we had 30 knots and Portland had 40 knots gusting to some number I cant remember. I was going to fly to Bend today but I would have had to cross the Cascades and the wind was out of the East so there was not a chance I was going to go. Bend wx was 190 degrees @ 11 knots which means the wind was really squirrelly in places. We had a big wind storm here yesterday with trees down, power out etc. It is one of the nasty storms that hits us every couple of years in the late fall.
Glad every thing worked out for you.
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

Thanks Frank, I knew about the storm yesterday (Tuesday 11th) we came over this morning at about 10 am had a tail wind from the east doing 170 knots that's one in a million chance as you know with the prevailing westerly winds. Nice and smooth too until 30 miles out the decent was choppy big time more than usual you know the drill you kick off the auto pilot and tighten you belt.

What was strange to me is I hand flew the old girl as usual when it gets really snotty pucker factor type air nothing out of the ordinary. Then wham like a rouge wave I was upside down looking at 4000 ft of air between us and the ground at full power never happen before to me. Could have been a freak mountain wave but I was not going to fool with Mother Nature when she flips my Commander ok sorry we are heading to the hotel with my tail between my legs.
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

Thank you Peter, I always thought the training was for thunderstorms in IFR but I know now clear sky's can be more of a threat than I thought. I hate rough air as eve one does but now I know it's it a real threat to your life even in clear sky's. Another lesson learned.
If my Commander can't deal with it we got BIG problems with Bad atmosphere.
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

Double post can't delete so now gone
 
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Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

Glad to hear everything worked out Brian and it's great you had that training.

Now the big question: did you have the video recorder running during this event?
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

That is exactly what I said after I landed. I wish I had the cameras running on that one. Every thing we own is in storage. We sold our home and are moving in to a new one in about 5 more days. We are living in a hotel at the moment so damn I was not prepared for a video. To bad too. I can only vision a vertical spinning air turbulent that would throw you ass over tea kettle like that. Would have made a good video.
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

It's 5 am and it will be back on the ol horse today. After a good air frame pre flight we shall roll again. Forecast today is looking much better. Stopping to get more cargo nets for the back seat as well lol.
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

"Roll again?" :) Hope not! Thanks for sharing, glad it worked out.
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

Holy Crap. That is so intense just hearing about it. I took a 2.5 day "unusual attitude & upset recovery" course last May in Tennessee and I think it was one of the smartest things I have ever done. Just getting comfortable, well, no perhaps the word is "aware" of what the plane looks like at totally unnatural angles and attitudes and then getting it upright successfully gives you a lot of confidence that you can have a successful outcome, as you did.
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

I am still a little in shock about the whole incident. It must be vary vary rare. I have had mountain flying training and it was not a mountain wave I don't think. Winds aloft maybe 40 knots I was miles from the mountains with climbing Terrain. I should study the terrain on the chart to see I can come up with any clues. What would a vertical circling colum of air be called a cyclone? I must figure this out now:D and hope it doesn't happen again. Maybe I should consult a meteorologist.
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

Sounds like wind-shear at alt and wondering what alt you were at, and check the reports for history and weather in the area? I had it happen one time in the Saratoga TC, and took off in a 35 knot winds 20 degrees off the nose,moderate turbulence and no problems till I was about 5K and was quickly almost upside down. Not as bad as you were but was from the different speeds of the winds at alt, another possibility is a micro-burst too but think you need some moisture for that.

Nice work and recovery and no question upset training is worth a million dollars.
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

I think it was a breaking wave now. A rouge mountain wave see article link below. Don't think I can hyper link with this IPAD may have to cut and paste.

I was at 5,500 climbing small 4,500 ft or so mountains a couple miles ahead fits the scenario in this article. I was under class B so that slowed my climb a little 500' above me but I'm almost clear. Looks like I better study mountain flying again. I don't think I could have avoided it was clear air no clues on this one. Just wrong place at the wrong time see breaking wave below good read. Tore an engine off a airliner nasty stuff.

www.aviationweather.gov/general/pubs/front/docs/nov-11.pdf
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

My personal minimums is 2000ft AGL over any of the smaller mountain ranges we have and 3000ft AGL over the rockies.

The Cascades can get nasty for sure. Been side to side but not a mega nose down attitude.
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

Frank,

Last couple days in PDX has been interesting. Left the other day and it was gusting to 48 in PDX. Came back about 5 hours later down the gorge and it was interesting to say the least. Then today was freezing rain and ice pellets. Turb not as bad as winds had died down to 30kts or so.

Would have been a good day to stay home and have a beer

Tim
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

They say in mt flying clinics if it's blowing hard stay 1/2 the hieght of the mt above it. Me too Frank I am never less than 2000 above the peaks more if it's blowing.

My personal minimums is 2000ft AGL over any of the smaller mountain ranges we have and 3000ft AGL over the rockies.

The Cascades can get nasty for sure. Been side to side but not a mega nose down attitude.
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

I am still a little in shock about the whole incident. It must be vary vary rare. I have had mountain flying training and it was not a mountain wave I don't think. Winds aloft maybe 40 knots I was miles from the mountains with climbing Terrain. I should study the terrain on the chart to see I can come up with any clues. What would a vertical circling colum of air be called a cyclone? I must figure this out now:D and hope it doesn't happen again. Maybe I should consult a meteorologist.

I think you should make a report on this and get someone official to study it. Crazy stuff. Is there a flight school associated with a university there? Or Call AOPA.
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

OK Brian.

I was reading you post last night when it was fresh off the press.

As I read I kept thinking that Sierra Bravo must be still in one piece as you were able to post. What a relief to read that SB (and you) are in good shape.

I have been in a few head knocking situations over the years, where I was reminding myself that the aircraft will take a lot more abuse than the pilot. And followed with an extra good pre-flight.

But in your situation I am wondering if there is a check list of items that should be really checked. Like removing inspection panels, in the tail section etc. Any input from members would be appreciated.

Also makes me think about better tie down of the cargo on every trip and all those loose things we have as missiles. Even down to the pee bottle.

I thought about sending Sierra Bravo a "get well" card, but that would be getting too mushy.

Life is a barrel of fun.
 
Re: Up set turbulence? Ouch

Good idea Ken I am just glad we were in a Commander and not some thin skinned bug smasher. I think being in a climb attitude at 95 to 100 knots may have made me easier to flip nose down but also was easier on the air frame.
My recovery was smooth trying not to stress her but the inishial flip forward was harsh. Best I could see with the eye and wiggling the tail, wings I detected no visible damage. Next day we had smooth ride back at 11,500 trimmed well no difference in her always smooth flight carictaristics. Will look inside when I get some time. I still think it was a breaking mt wave circling forward my direction of travel. Had to be small like 50 ft radius wish I could have seen it coming.

Here is the spot I was at 5,500 ft little Cascade foot hills ahead a few miles.

AOTFLIP_zps12a2e9ab.jpg
 
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