maybe owner

[FlyGuy]

hi all, yes great website with lots of info for newbies. thanks for not locking us out! I'm looking at a '76 114, all new to me, so learning fast. flew in it. performance was underwhelming, so keen to find ways to improve that.

 

[Commander91gm]

A lot depends on what your mission is. No commanders are not the fastest airplanes out there but they are way more comfortable than most of the options. The difference that another 10 knots would make even when going from Arizona to Florida just isn't sufficient for me to fly a Mooney and be uncomfortable in my airplane all year long.

 

[David Price]

Curious what speeds were you seeing?

 

[FlyGuy]

was only a short flight with no time to settle in the cruise. the aircraft has not flown much recently, and I doubt the current owner has spent time fettling it to optimise. seems like 160ktas is a good aim point, and achievable - yes/no?

 

[David Price]

I flight plan 150kts. 114B's will be a little faster.

 

[FlyGuy]

do you have the tail incidence STC?

 

[Chris Mixon]

I flight plan 150kts. 114B's will be a little faster.

Wow, I only see 141-142 in cruise on my 114A on a good day in the summer, but it's 20C at 8000 feet around here right now. 145-146 in the winter. I know I'm losing a few knots to surface friction with my old paint, but I didn't think it was that much.

 

[Chris Mixon]

hi all, yes great website with lots of info for newbies. thanks for not locking us out! I'm looking at a '76 114, all new to me, so learning fast. flew in it. performance was underwhelming, so keen to find ways to improve that.

114s are not speedy, but they are very comfortable. The cabin is wide enough that no one invades your personal space, and two doors mean you can supervise passenger loading and then get in last. The seating position is more SUV-like and less sports-car-like, unlike a Mooney. You also have a very wide COG and really can't load them out of aft CG, unlike a Bonanza, and they are priced much lower than a comparable 182 RG, even though it looks to me like asking prices are climbing again.

They are also a VERY stable IFR platform. I do agree that I would like to have another 20 gallons, but I don't have a 4-hour bladder, so 3-hour IFR legs and 4 hr VFR is acceptable.

 

[David Price]

I don' t have the Super Steam mod yet.

 

[David Price]

Chris, I don't know about paint drag but rigging for sure, gear doors, low flaps, rudder trim etc.

 

[rringgold]

I received a printout from one of the previous owners of my 112. He stressed the point that I might arrive 15 minutes later than a Mooney or Bonanza, but that I would be more refreshed and more comfortable.
I toy with the prospect of a Bonanza, but the thought of having one door incites some claustrophobia.
I’ve flown in a couple of Mooney’s and they are too cramped.
I’ve yet to fly in a Bo…

 

[janderson]

remember, "you wear a Mooney, you FLY a Commander" : )

Judi

 

[farmerandy]

I can get close to these numbers with my stock 114B. Would I like to go faster? Sure nothing in life is free.

 

[Avee8tor]

I knew I wasn't going to get Bonanza speeds when I bought mine but I did know I wasn't getting Bonanza maintenance costs.

I just picked up my new to me 114 and flew it from KY to FL. In all because of weather and re-routes a total of 6.5 hours block and it certainly didn't feel like that much, so comfortable and roomy. Handled turbulence like it wasn't really there. As for the speed, fought headwinds the whole route from 4K to 8K but indicated between 125-130k @ ISA +18 averaging around 14GPH whole trip. Now I do have the Hot Shot STC so was able to maintain 24/24 at altitude but also a little richer for #5 & 6 CHT's, hence the burns. I figure after getting more time in it I can refine these numbers a little especially after I look into the CHT things a little more (found one issue with the baffles) and get the VG's removed which eat 4-5 kts.

So glad I went down this route considering I was looking at the F33 and Arrow III/IV's.

 

[Chris Mixon]

I can get close to these numbers with my stock 114B. Would I like to go faster? Sure nothing in life is free.

Andy, I had never looked at the performance charts for the B. In the A, we don't have TAS in the performance chart; that info is in another chart and derived from the power % we get from the MAP and RPM at altitude chart. I think I am going to take the 114A Charts and recreate them using the format used for the 114B; the info is much more concise and usable.

 

[Chris Mixon]

Chris, I don't know about paint drag but rigging for sure, gear doors, low flaps, rudder trim etc.

Dave, I have checked rigging, gear droop and such since that would be a lot less expensive fix

According to my research, the rise in parasitic drag from real rough old paint is about 3-5%, and for GA aircraft results in an average decrease of 2-5 kts. 114SG is still in its original 1979 paint and it's in poor shape. We tried to wax and smooth it out and only ended up with more paint loss. I'm still happy at 143 KTAS, just jealous when I hear folks seeing 5-8 kts faster. If I wanted speed, I woulda gone with the Ovation.

I have had paint on my budget list for all three years since I got her, but each year, we have had a major project that ate that budget. Gear in year one, fuel tanks in year two, and time-limited items like Mags, Aspen batteries, and Autopilot problems, along with general upkeep stuff in year 3. Hopefully year 4 is the year

 

[David Price]

Another item missing in the speed conversation is hp. Newer engines are likely producing more hp than higher time engines. Even a 6% loss in power (15.6 hp) could be the elusive 5 ktas.

 

[Chris Mixon]

Another item missing in the speed conversation is hp. Newer engines are likely producing more hp than higher time engines. Even a 6% loss in power (15.6 hp) could be the elusive 5 ktas.

It's all part of the journey as I learn about this airframe. I am at about 500 hrs since major overhaul with all new cylinders and a new prop after the previous owner had a runway excursion when the nosewheel steering cable popped and struck a runway light, but the powerplant as a whole was originally manufactured when I was in high school If I'm still flying this airframe when I get to major overhaul again (at the current rate I'm building hours, I'll be in my late 70s), I think I will spend the extra to get a factory new or reman just to get the extended TBO they are now advertising.

I'm starting to want a Turbo to get up higher and cooler, but I also want FIKI in my next airplane. I know that there are rare Commanders (one maybe?) that are Turbo / FIKI, but at the expected price point, I will probably also be looking at Malibu's Matrix's , A36s, or a Turbo 210

Adam Clark had a really nice 114 Turbo in his shop last time I was there, and it got me thinking

 

[David Price]

I'm with you a turbo would be nice, but the way fuel prices are going I may need a Rotax!

 

[FlyGuy]

Agree it is roomy and the two doors are a bonus. As is the Lyc. engine vs Cont., IMO. McCauley is a low-maintenance prop also. The essentials are there. What is the 'hot shot' mod? Do the 112TC/114B extended wingtips/span change performance much over the vanilla 114?