Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

[TKutchera]

I was driving home tonight and as a volunteer firefighter have an app that dispatches calls to my phone. There was one for a structure fire at my airport. Most fires are false reports and this time of year we get a lot of calls for steam rising off roofs when it gets cold on clear nights like this and it was getting foggy about 10 pm, I figured thatd be the case. Luckily we have a fire dept right on the airport grounds and about a minute after the dispatch, the initial "size up" as we call it was for a fully involved row of hangers and a request for a second alarm which sent an additional 10 engines.

I immediately hauled butt for the airport and got there after about 3 engines had arrived to find exploding hangers blowing doors off and flames easily 30' high.

Ended up loosing 8 hangers and airplanes tonight. Fortunately, mine was not affected, but there were many very nice airplanes lost tonight.

No word on what caused it as it is too soon.

I know at least three of the guys that lost airplanes and they were nice ones. 2 bonanza's, a cardinal, and a really nice 180. Ill go back up tomorrow as I was l planning on cleaning 4,000 miles of bugs and dirt off mine from the fly in and take more pictures in the daylight.

Tim

 

[Frank]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

I too got a call from a friend that wanted to know if I knew any pilots from Camas to give them a heads up on the fire. Isn't the fire station right next door?

 

[TKutchera]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

Yes it is. On the field. They responded in less than two minutes and immediately reported a fully involved hanger fire and called for a second alarm. I was listening to the whole thing until i got there.

Ill take pictures tomorrow when I go back.

Tim

 

[gmores]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

Very sad. Glad no one was hurt.

 

[N4843W]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

You know, at our airport tenants have been complaining about the authority getting tougher on hangar content storage, including me. But there is a hangar next door to mine that is filled to the brim with junk including two old pickups. The nice old guy had not flown for 10 years, sold his plane, and would just sit in his chair and watch people and planes go by. No one wanted to hassle him and that was good. But he passed on 6 months ago and his wife cannot deal with all of his stuff, his kids live far away. Now, I can just see this rats nest catching fire and taking my hangar and a bunch of others with it. Scary stuff. On one hand, she is still paying the rent and I hate for an old grieving widow to have to deal with this (and yes, her husband should have.) On the other hand, the risks are great.

 

[TKutchera]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

Update: Airport still NOTAM'd closed and no access for anyone being allowed. The loss total is up to 14 now, although a nice Navion and Bonanza I thought were lost were pulled out by their owners who live across the field before it spread to their end.

The FD had a hard time accessing water as the hydrants are not connected to the city water but to storage tanks the Port maintains. Took almost 40 minutes before they were able to flow water, although in all honesty I dont think it would have mattered due to the extensions and intensity fo the fire when i got there. I arrived right behind the third in engine as the explosions were starting. they did call in 3 tenders to supply water since the hydrants were not working. Im sure this will be brought up as I pay 310 a month to supposedly have those hydrants and water sources maintained and available for these situations.

Scott, interesting you mention that as I got the email below from our state pilot association about a NPRM from the FAA for airports receiving Federal funding.

It is too early to speculate on what or even where it started so its hard to say if it was tied in with junk in someones hanger or electrical problems which I would guess it is.

Following is the email and link, but the comment period actually closed last night about an hour before the fire started.

Tim
----------------------

The FAA has released a Notice of Proposed Rulemaking (NPRM) regarding non-aeronautical use of airport hangars. Although the proposed rules apply only to obligated airports (those that have accepted federal funding), the proposal addresses issues that are non-existent and fails to address issues that do exist. It also sets precedents that would be damaging to the health of airports and General Aviation.

A guide to the NPRM and how to comment, including example comments, has been posted on our website. Go to the WPA website (http://www.wpaflys.org/) and look for the "URGENT" link on the right side of the page.

URGENT - The comment period ends Monday evening at 8:59 pm pacific time.

Please add your voice to this important issue.

thanks,
Les

Les Smith
State President
Washington Pilots Association

 

[N4843W]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

I agree completely, Tim. There is no way to know at this point the source and although the fire investigators are often amazing, sometimes they never reach a conclusion.

But as a caution, I called our hangar owner and told him to Google it ... his reaction was "Holy SH#t!!!" He is going to inspect the hangar next to mine and several other for potential hazards. We are all neighbors in thinly-separated metal buildings which cannot sand up to the heat of 50 gallons of avgas. I may have mentioned this a couple of weeks ago, but some "gentleman of good intent but questionable intelligence" decided to paint his cherokee in his hangar with his door partially open. As a result, all sorts of people with planes inside of neighboring hangars have overspray. I am a whole row over, but my mechanic was working on the plane with door up one of those days (he did not know the paint was going on, but in retrospect he "thought he smelled something." I now have very light, but still visible overspray on my windshield. Not a big deal for me, but some of the guys have MAJOR overspray. So what do you do about that? None of us want more big-brothering, but sometimes rules are needed.

Update: Airport still NOTAM'd closed and no access for anyone being allowed. The loss total is up to 14 now, although a nice Navion and Bonanza I thought were lost were pulled out by their owners who live across the field before it spread to their end.

The FD had a hard time accessing water as the hydrants are not connected to the city water but to storage tanks the Port maintains. Took almost 40 minutes before they were able to flow water, although in all honesty I dont think it would have mattered due to the extensions and intensity fo the fire when i got there. I arrived right behind the third in engine as the explosions were starting. they did call in 3 tenders to supply water since the hydrants were not working. Im sure this will be brought up as I pay 310 a month to supposedly have those hydrants and water sources maintained and available for these situations.

Scott, interesting you mention that as I got the email below from our state pilot association about a NPRM from the FAA for airports receiving Federal funding.

It is too early to speculate on what or even where it started so its hard to say if it was tied in with junk in someones hanger or electrical problems which I would guess it is.

Following is the email and link, but the comment period actually closed last night about an hour before the fire started.

Tim
----------------------

The FAA has released a Notice of Proposed Rulemaking (NPRM) regarding non-aeronautical use of airport hangars. Although the proposed rules apply only to obligated airports (those that have accepted federal funding), the proposal addresses issues that are non-existent and fails to address issues that do exist. It also sets precedents that would be damaging to the health of airports and General Aviation.

A guide to the NPRM and how to comment, including example comments, has been posted on our website. Go to the WPA website (http://www.wpaflys.org/) and look for the "URGENT" link on the right side of the page.

URGENT - The comment period ends Monday evening at 8:59 pm pacific time.

Please add your voice to this important issue.

thanks,
Les

Les Smith
State President
Washington Pilots Association

 

[gmores]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

Hard to know what might be more hazardous - a vented plane with 68 gallons of avgas or the jag parked under the wing.

I would agree that if there's nothing aviation related going on, it probably shouldn't be in a hangar at an airport getting tax dollars.

 

[N4843W]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

Agreed ... but building a plane, or working on pieces of a plane, that should be all good. I think the AOPA/EAA will be successful beating back the FAA on that one. Of course, if that were strictly true Glenn, where the hell would Lonnie Sleep on all the nights Jo kicks him out of the house? Well, I guess he can leave tools out by his cot and claim he is working on the SuperCommander.

 

[CenAir]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

Update: Airport still NOTAM'd closed and no access for anyone being allowed. The loss total is up to 14 now, although a nice Navion and Bonanza I thought were lost were pulled out by their owners who live across the field before it spread to their end.

The FD had a hard time accessing water as the hydrants are not connected to the city water but to storage tanks the Port maintains. Took almost 40 minutes before they were able to flow water, although in all honesty I dont think it would have mattered due to the extensions and intensity fo the fire when i got there. I arrived right behind the third in engine as the explosions were starting. they did call in 3 tenders to supply water since the hydrants were not working. Im sure this will be brought up as I pay 310 a month to supposedly have those hydrants and water sources maintained and available for these situations.

Scott, interesting you mention that as I got the email below from our state pilot association about a NPRM from the FAA for airports receiving Federal funding.

It is too early to speculate on what or even where it started so its hard to say if it was tied in with junk in someones hanger or electrical problems which I would guess it is.

Following is the email and link, but the comment period actually closed last night about an hour before the fire started.

Tim
----------------------

Tim

I am too part time long time FF in my home town in MA and my vacation house on the island in Maine, as you know cars, trucks and planes don't expolde in a fire like they do on tv in movies as the tanks are vented. Cars and trucks have a temperature relief for which prevents them from exploding and just releases the pressure and increases the fire but no explosions from the car or truck is possible.

As for the planes exploding too isn't going to happen in a fire with a vented tank and going to be just like a routine car/truck fire which release a lot of fire at xx temperature but no explosions for sure.

Could be as often reported to 911 a Fire and Explosion in car/truck accidents on the roads by the bystanders and usually caused by the tires when they explode from the heat and scares the crowded to death.

Wondering if you saw the explosion and if it truly was one and not tires blowing up, betting someone had some fuel stored in 55 gallon drums in a hanger, often not grounded properly which is another long story but in a sealed 55 gallon drum would explode easily in a fire and real hazard for all plane owners at the ap.

I ratted out one person out a few years ago to MassPort at my ap after talking to him directly that was storing four 55 gallon drums of auto fuel he could use on his plane, none of them grounded or vented properly and was an accident waiting to happen and got no were with the idiot pilot even after I told him I was a FF and would report it to them if he didn't get rid of it.

He got thrown out of the ap and bet he is in another place doing the same thing and glad he got booted as he had no clue how many FF could be killed in a fire responding to a fire in his hanger when that 200+ gallons goes kaboom.

Are you on the new FF system "I Am Responding"
Software as that's what we have been using for many years and works very good ?

I know what happen on "The FD had a hard time accessing water as the hydrants are not connected to the city water but to storage tanks the Port maintains. Took almost 40 minutes before they were able to flow water" tough situation we don't see much but wondering why they didn't use the engines water which at a minimum should be 500-750 gallons on a typical E-1? On the Island we got 2000 gallons on E-6 with only two hydrants and is always first out, and also draft out of the water to refill which is a PIA as the hydrant is often far away.

 

[N4843W]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

Paul, I personally saw a pontiac station wagon explode on the interstate once pretty ferociously. The family was out and away but a couple of onlookers got minor burns and their eyebrows and eyelashes singed off. I was 100+ feet away and felt a significant concussion and the was quite a fireball. I am sure the tank exploded at that point but it never occurred to me that in might have been the tire that then ignited the gas? (He was definitely running LOP. See what happens?)

 

[Sherman]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

Agreed ... but building a plane, or working on pieces of a plane, that should be all good. I think the AOPA/EAA will be successful beating back the FAA on that one. Of course, if that were strictly true Glenn, where the hell would Lonnie Sleep on all the nights Jo kicks him out of the house? Well, I guess he can leave tools out by his cot and claim he is working on the SuperCommander.

Both Virginia State DOAviation and and Virginia Business Aviation whatever said same thing:educational, building planes, repairing etc all bring business/activity, economics to the airports.

And the Jag & or Jensen when at the hanger are under the T tail, not under
the wing. They are Aircraft projects support vehicles.

And sometimes, going or coming from the tree farm, Camellia
drops me off at the hanger because 'she has 'her business to do', and I can go flying, putz @ the hanger on plane projects-- and have 'transportation home'. Its called Life Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. I pay for the space I pay for, and Will use ALL of it as I see fit and what fits and when I see fit. At MTN, in the 90s-9/11; we used to move the classic cars out next to the hanger each May. NO inspections in Winter when I needed the space most.

But true dangerous rags are a different story. And storage of junk-not Kosher.

Right now I am setting up 'my Oshkish 2HT for the functionality and atmospherics. Why waste 2-4 hrs commuting when I can just crash in cozy and resume the project.

 

[TKutchera]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

Paul,

I was there when one of the hangers exploded. Blew the doors off. Dont know what it was, but it definitely wasnt tires. I dont doubt theres stuff in some of those that is combustible beside airplanes with fuel in them.There were several other smaller "pops" that I am sure were tires or small aerosol type cans. Lots of guys have compressors, etc. There were 11 type 1 engines so thats where they got their water from and then filled with four tenders being rotated in. I dont know for sure about the engines that came in from Vancouver but I know our four that were there had foam on them too, but they were using mostly water from what I could see.

They are looking at the pressure pump and why it failed when they tried to take the hydrants. Going to be some interesting fall out from this it sounds like.

They are opening the airport tomorrow at 8 am. We werent even allowed in to our hangers today at all. The airport will be NOTAM'd closed from 6pm to 8am for the next few days.

Ill take some more pictures tomorrow and post them.

Sounds like the actual numbers are not as first reported by the Port director who should have known this stuff right away. But ten hangers lost, 8 airplanes: 2 Cherokee 180's, a nice Cessna 140, a nice Cessna 180, a Tri-Pacer, a RV-6, a C-182 and a Bonanza. one guy had three older Porches in his too. One hanger was empy as the owner had flown it to Arizona recently on a trip. Not sure about the status of the tenth hanger airplane.

I saw a couple of the guys who were taken down to their hangers by the Fire Marshall and they said they couldnt even tell there was an airplane in there outside of the engine block.

Sad,
Tim

 

[Pete]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

The city of Phoenix in the 80's had two hangar fires from guys leaving battery chargers on using household type extension cords. Guess what, from then with the city of Phx no extension cords unless you are there, can't leave plugged in when not in hangar. Also can't store any "non airplane" stuff in hangar. PS can leave a frig plugged if 18" off the floor. I agree with this, I saw the results of the two fires.

 

[Sherman]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

I can't even imagine the heartache the owners must be experiencing. I used 12-2 Romex (with plug)to wire up 3 outlets on the back wall for charger, coffee maker & mini griller with switched outlet. Was tired of the extension cords and 'tangles'. Now use low watt drop light for empennage investigations on own line. Insisted airpirt mgr change WW2 outlet to 20 amp CFI outlet breaker.

 

[CenAir]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

Tim

Sounds like stored fuel in a capped 55 gallon drum based on the description of the explosion I am betting, as you know vented gas containers don't explode they just melt and spread and fuel a fire.

Good to no FF got hurt when the explosion occurred and just imagine if they were entering the building on the A side when it went off. We have one 750 gallon engine that has built in automatic mixing of foam set with the levers, so no need to manually mix and hook up jugs and set a foam rate and much easier now with the new rig automatically setting foam or just water.

 

[RNC]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

The city of Phoenix in the 80's had two hangar fires from guys leaving battery chargers on using household type extension cords. Guess what, from then with the city of Phx no extension cords unless you are there, can't leave plugged in when not in hangar. Also can't store any "non airplane" stuff in hangar. PS can leave a frig plugged if 18" off the floor. I agree with this, I saw the results of the two fires.

I don't see why the airport doesn't just provide proper extension cords at a markup.

Want to use one? Must buy it from the FBO.

I have an uncle that does stupid stuff like this. He has a table saw running in his shop off of a lamp cord extension. Of course the saw's overload sensing switch will trip with that kind of heat in the line, so he had to eliminate that switch too. His replacement 220v switch is two light switches with a nail stuck between them. The next house he burns down will be the second one, he's already burned one house to the ground.

Telling him he can't have extension cords wouldn't solve all of his problems, though, he'd still find a way.

 

[CenAir]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

Paul, I personally saw a pontiac station wagon explode on the interstate once pretty ferociously. The family was out and away but a couple of onlookers got minor burns and their eyebrows and eyelashes singed off. I was 100+ feet away and felt a significant concussion and the was quite a fireball. I am sure the tank exploded at that point but it never occurred to me that in might have been the tire that then ignited the gas? (He was definitely running LOP. See what happens?)

Scott

Fuel in a tank in a liquid form can't explode as it needs air and oxygen in a confined space which is displaced by fuel vapors so sorry no explosion from the tank like they show in the movies. Most auto tanks are plastic and vented so they don't build pressure and explode, they simple melt and you get of course a large increase in a fire when that happens.

Tires burn through first in a car fire and when they explode introduce air and oxygen and look like a big explosion to people. More than likely I would say there might have been an Lp tank in the vehicle which when heated go off like big bomb.

Could have been the magnesium in the steering column that explodes real good when water hits it, and here is some basic info on it:

http://www.firehouse.com/article/11300616/firefighter-training-extinguishing-magnesium-fires

 

[milojevicp]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

Dear Tim,

Very terrible event. I trust your aircraft did not get affected by the projectiles?

All the best,

Pete

 

[TKutchera]

Re: Sad day at my airport - Camas WA

Hi Pete,

Our plane is safe thankfully, but I spent about 2 hours up there today after they finally let us in. Very sad to see. The guys in this hanger row were as passionate about their airplanes as we are. Visited with many of them as they were finally allowed in to see what was left. many of these guys were restoring or had restored beautiful planes and were long time owners. Ive attached a few pics I took. It amazed me at the heat that melted everything including the props.