Need a mentor

[gfoulks]

Greetings to you all!

i am in the market for my first plane. I’m tired of renting and dealing with beat up equipment. I’ve looked at so many planes over the months from Mooney, Beech, Piper but I’ve got this 112 in my favorites that keeps pulling me to it, I don’t know why.

id like to talk to other owners to help guide me through this process. Anyone have any knowledge on N202RR looks like it is based at San Antonio, TX. Beautiful plane. Why do I keep seeing complaints about speed and useful load?

 

[Charlie]

Greg, welcome aboard! That's a plane listed for sale by Suncoast Aviation - Judi Anderson. I can't heartily enough suggest you call her. She was incredibly helpful and instrumental in my first purchase - I have N1094J a 1973 112HS. Don't hesitate contacting her, she can answer every question you can come up with (well about airplanes, at least!!).

 

[alim]

if you're in the 112s - suggest you get a ride in

- 112A or B
- 112Hotshot
- 112TC

prior to a purchase.

if none meet your mission / expectations then you're looking at a 114A , 114B,. 114TC

If none of those meet your mission - then the commander isn't for you.

My mission profile for a 112TC hasn't changed in 20 yrs.

 

[gmascelli]

Greg,

As Charlie noted, contact Judi, she is a wealth of knowledge. She helped us find our 112A and close the deal. We love our new ride.

 

[gfoulks]

Yes Judi and I have touched base, thanks all! My mission is rather simple. The wife told me to buy a plane and fly her around the country. I also need a platform to do my IFR training in. I have no interest in having other passengers and we don’t carry a bunch of luggage for weekend trips. I am not to concerned about speed but I do want to fly as economical as possible.

 

[Airotto370]

Mozzam nails it. The mission includes where you'll do most of your flying. A straight 112 is fine for what you describe if you are mostly flying east coast/lowlands. For higher altitude bases a hot shot/TC, mebbe straight bigger engined 114 is better suited.
Indicate where you are based and you'll get sage advice from locals.

 

[gfoulks]

Mozzam nails it. The mission includes where you'll do most of your flying. A straight 112 is fine for what you describe if you are mostly flying east coast/lowlands. For higher altitude bases a hot shot/TC, mebbe straight bigger engined 114 is better suited.
Indicate where you are based and you'll get sage advice from locals.

Columbus, Ohio East of the Mississippi is where I’ll do most of my flying. With the occasional trip to the Dakotas, Grand Canon and maybe Vegas.

 

[alim]

For something like that, it would be a bit of a stretch for the straight 112. Will it do it ? yes. But will require careful planning.

You can still check it out to make up your mind.

That puts you into a turbo-normalized 112HS. Whatever horsepower the engine sees at sea-level under ambient conditions - it will deliver into the teens.
Or a Turbo-charged 112TC. The engine is boosted. It WILL make 210 HP all the way to the teens. Hotter running engine. Has some nuance. But it's a cult no one leaves.

Plan on cruise speeds in the high 130s-140 kts range.

Faster you say ? 114. Upto 8K. After that a turbocharged or turbo normalized bird with will take over.
Or you get into a 114TC. Expensive bird to maintain but certainly very capable.





For my mission - the 112TC. 1000 lbs useful load.
Cruise speeds in the high 130s to low 140s. Rarely on the east coast do i find myself above 9K.
Very capable IFR platform.

Are there other singles out there - comparable ? i think the A36 bonanza or the B36TC compares well. But the planes are narrower and the commander will simply be more comfortable.
Want to give up comfort for speed ? Then just get a Mooney.

I have no desire to own a bonanza or a Mooney. I see them in the shop where maint gets done all the time.


If i ever let the Commander go, the only step-up bird worth considering is a Piper Malibu. I have 2 kids headed to college in a few yrs. I am sticking to my 112TC.

 

[mcgrathm]

Columbus, Ohio East of the Mississippi is where I’ll do most of my flying. With the occasional trip to the Dakotas, Grand Canon and maybe Vegas.

I’m from Tennessee and 6’’ft 6””inch 285lbs. I’ve had my 112A for about 6-7 years now and love it. My normal cruise alt on cross country is usually 8500-9500. Local would be lower. I fly almost every year over the Rockies to Salem Oregon without an issue. Careful planning over the lowest peeks is all you need. My highest peak going over is about 9000 and I usually go to about 13500. So if your staying in the lowlands mostly with occasional higher altitude like myself you’ll love a 112. Attached is a pic of my plane in Layton Utah after crossing the mountains. True it doesn’t fly as high as some of the turbos and 114’s, but I don’t need to go that high around hear with my flight mission which is usually 1.5 hrs round trip and some 3.5 hr cross countries.
.

 

[gmores]

Greetings to you all!

i am in the market for my first plane. I’m tired of renting and dealing with beat up equipment. I’ve looked at so many planes over the months from Mooney, Beech, Piper but I’ve got this 112 in my favorites that keeps pulling me to it, I don’t know why.

id like to talk to other owners to help guide me through this process. Anyone have any knowledge on N202RR looks like it is based at San Antonio, TX. Beautiful plane. Why do I keep seeing complaints about speed and useful load?

No issues in the 112 for useful load for 2 adults & full fuel. And with a TAS at 130-135 kts at 11 gph, it's pretty economical, too. LOP around 8gph with about a 5-7 knot loss.

About 20 years ago Aviation Consumer did a pretty negative review of the Commander - basically their opinion was that anything that wasn't a Mooney was junk. That was when I cancelled by subscription to anything they published. But a lot of pilots and mechanics that aren't really familiar with the Commander still parrot that story's incorrect conclusions; slow and hard to service & get parts.

To help compare models you can browse all the specs in our FAQ. Sounds to me like a straight 112 would work great for you.

Good luck with your search.

 

[alim]

To be clear - with a Commander , if you have an Mx issue on the road - most things will be just fine,.
But some things are nuanced, however no more so than a mooney , bonanza and so on.

Point i am making is - if your mechanic maintains cessna 172s and piper warriors - he isnt going to magically transform to sort out commander issues.

so 2 roads there. You as an owner invest the time to learn/understand some systems and guide your mechanic. Or go to a shop that knows commanders well.

You paying your mechanic to learn how to service this bird on your dime will not be economical and will not get you best results ..

 

[jakoehn]

"Need Mentor" , Come to the Fly Inn , Fredericksburg , Texas , September 12 - 15/2019 , check here for details

Juergen Koehn
N5893N , 114AGT

 

[wiguy]

With two people the ‘’station wagon mod’’(rear seats out) helps a bit, 40lbs worth. Lots of flights don’t require 68 gallons of fuel. Fall is here soon, cool temps assist also. I’m always looking for favorable winds too.

 

[painlesspotter]

Canadian Bucket List
A 31 yr Sgt in the Toronto Police Service (see below) made an inquiry into the 114 that I have on BarnStormers. After a few exchanges, I deduced that he wants to become a pilot and to own a complex aircraft. I suspect he could benefit from some communication with other COGers in the Ottawa area over a cup of coffee. Maybe he could join a pilot's group at a nearby airport. Of course, what he wants to do is possible, but not something that I would recommend. Seasoning through instruction in fixed gear aircraft is what I would think appropriate for now. If a COGer in that area could give him a call and let me know I would appreciate it.
Regards,
John Potter
alias---painlesspotter
N4887W
john.potter@1958.usna.com
Contact info:
Wayne Lakey
Wlakey@sympatico.ca
4168083967
Toronto
Ontario, Canada

 

[proppilot]

Hi John, Wayne is right next door to a bunch of us here. Rod (my partner), Phil, Dave etc. He will get a call.. And in the spirit of geographical ribbing.... Toronto to Ottawa is like Benicia to Bakersfield ;-)

 

[mrcshbs]

Judi absolutely pointed me in the right direction with the commander. She is a straight shooter and won't set up you up for failure. I walked away from a sale before buying my current 112 last year.

This is my humble opinion from my 112.

If you got a big family, get a 114. If you fly above 12.500 ft get a 114 or 112TC. Anything else, the 112 will be great airplane with absolutely amazing room. It's like a car. None of that rubbing shoulders like piper's and Bo's. Taking out the rear seats give you a lot more room back there as well.

If you want to take your wife on a vacation, the 112 will be just fine. You can certainly do it. Just plan accordingly via the POH numbers (with wiggle room) like you would do with any other airplane. It's an amazing cross country platform. Just it to the Bahamas for the weekend.

If you have foreflight (free trial available I think), plan a cross country trip and see how it would go using the 112 profile. This would give you an idea on how many stops you need and TO/landing performance numbers. Most flights don't need full fuel and after couple of hours my bladder is getting full. I keep my legs like 2-3 hours if I can.

Here is the lesson learned:
My 112 will not fit my mission in a few of months (Family growing). So I will be getting rid of it and be looking to buy a 114. I've spend my life savings on my 112 and I will never even come close of breaking even. So if you're done having kids and it's just your and wife having a good time, the 112 is a good fit

My 2 cents.


Marcos.

 

[Pete]

Marcos, to your point, I got my first Commander, a 112,N1247J in 1981(?), in 1983 I needed and IFR plane and in Phoenix the 112 didn't do well in the heat. In Sept 1983 traded up to a full IFR 114, N114MT, and I never looked back. 2600 hours and lots of upgrades I have NO regrets, love my N114MT.

 

[mrcshbs]

Hey Pete, I am upgrading to 114 soon. I am sure the 114 is better machine. The heat will plague every airplane, but my 112 seems a lot heavier in the summer and it seems to be more susceptible. I think that's why I wanted to point out that a good flight plan is the key. You got to consider the numbers before every flight. In fact there is an airport much closer to my house with cheaper hangar rates. I simply couldn't even go there. Maybe by myself in a cool day. Runway is paved, but way to short for me.

 

[carllee]

I think upgrade is kinda a harsh term for those of us that love our 112's - perhaps move to a model that better fit's your desired mission would be a better way of putting it. "Upgrade" is also not necessarily across the board accurate when it comes to moving from one Commander model to another. For instance, if I were flying a 114B, and I was based in Colorado, and made regular trips across the Rockies, and only flew with my wife & my dog, and my desire is to fly faster, moving to a 112HS would be an "upgrade"

Here are some interesting numbers to ponder.

by the numbers 1.pdf

 

[Pete]

Carl you need to fly across the Colorado Rockies at 17.5K in your (my) 114 Hotshot. 169KTS TAS, LOP 11.7 gph, TIT 1555, it was fun.